Froelich

Quote from: Taysby on March 12, 2016, 09:35:56 PM

Quote from: griffin131 on March 12, 2016, 02:16:40 PM

Quote from: Mattao19 on March 11, 2016, 04:59:39 PM

Did the pros not work hard all day to put themselves in a position to draw/concede?

His opponent also worked hard all weekend and was at 13-0. Trying to sweep a GP which has never been done before is a worthwhile goal.

Didn't lsv do it?

Correct. He went 16-0 at 2010 Pro Tour San Diego.
Source: www.channelf.....cott-vargas/

That was a Pro Tour, not a Grand Prix.

Quote from: rarehuntertay on March 12, 2016, 10:00:16 PM

Quote from: Taysby on March 12, 2016, 09:35:56 PM

Quote from: griffin131 on March 12, 2016, 02:16:40 PM

Quote from: Mattao19 on March 11, 2016, 04:59:39 PM

Did the pros not work hard all day to put themselves in a position to draw/concede?

His opponent also worked hard all weekend and was at 13-0. Trying to sweep a GP which has never been done before is a worthwhile goal.

Didn't lsv do it?

Correct. He went 16-0 at 2010 Pro Tour San Diego.
Source: www.channelf.....cott-vargas/

That was a Pro Tour, not a Grand Prix.

Nmv... I cannot read today

Point is like everyone else said, someone else worked hard to get into top 8 to, why should he get in off a free win vs the other guy who played

Lol have you guys ever played in a competitive tournament? It's a nice thing to do for somebody. E Fro had top breakers out of his point class and got paired up. He should NOT expect a concession BUT he has every right to ask and every right to be upset with his opponents decision there.

Lol have you guys ever played in a competitive tournament? It's a nice thing to do for somebody. E Fro had top breakers out of his point class and got paired up. He should NOT expect a concession BUT he has every right to ask and every right to be upset with his opponents decision there.

Yeah, of course he can ASK. Only if he offers something in return does it become against Tourney regs. (Wait, isn't that what he's saying: the bye will earn you "standing" in the pro community).
Yet, in my opinion he is NOT allowed to be upset about a refusal.
It is the same as being upset not having drawn that one card that would have won you the game.

To come back on my earlier thought.

Tournament rules state:

Players may not agree to a concession or draw in exchange for any reward or incentive. Doing so will be considered Bribery (see section 5.2).

ANY incentive. Even if that incentive is as obscure as "I'll owe you one".

Not a tournament player, but definitely a reasonable adult. EF can ask, simply because it is not against the rules. It is extremely poor gamesmanship for him to be pissed when he doesn't get the answer he wants.

Strategy was mentioned, regarding a mental break. But what about the strategy of keeping out a good player? Dude is basically a whiner and deserved what happened to him as well as any possible backlash.

To come back on my earlier thought.

Tournament rules state:

Players may not agree to a concession or draw in exchange for any reward or incentive. Doing so will be considered Bribery (see section 5.2).

ANY incentive. Even if that incentive is as obscure as "I'll owe you one".

As long as E Fro doesn't say will you concede to me and I owe you one its not bribery if you just ask for a concession it's kosher

Ya lol man I mean I've had opponents concede to me to put me through and I've had opponents dream crush me. Idc either way but it's a nice gesture for them. Sure we come to play magic but in round 13 or 14 of a 2-day event that hour break is huge. And it's totally reasonable for E Fro to expect a concession. But I guess that concept is hard for non-spikes.

Thanks Noble but it's fine lol I get my opinion is the opposite of most ppl here but it doesn't make me wrong and it doesn't make me right either we just have different stances.

Quote from: Kaylesh on March 14, 2016, 04:40:45 AM

To come back on my earlier thought.

Tournament rules state:

Players may not agree to a concession or draw in exchange for any reward or incentive. Doing so will be considered Bribery (see section 5.2).

ANY incentive. Even if that incentive is as obscure as "I'll owe you one".

As long as E Fro doesn't say will you concede to me and I owe you one its not bribery if you just ask for a concession it's kosher

The thing is, that's his whole point in the article. It would be good for you to concede because of standing in the pro circuit. In fact he states he'd not play a guy who has conceded before eliminitation rounds.
That's basically saying he'd offer a price split later if someone concedes in Swiss.
Rules-wise it would only be penalized if it happened right there. However, I think his article goes against the spirit of the rule.

And indeed, I'm not a spike, or have much tourney experience. I did notice myself starting to make play errors after 6 hours of prerelease, so I can imagine having a break is nice though.

TLDR: it is ok to ask to agree on draw or bye, however I strongly disagree with the article.

He never offered a prize split though. Rules are as long as you don't offer reward you're good.

And Wizard why doesn't E Fro deserve the top 8 he battled just as hard and had the better breakers so why shouldn't he get the spot? That's only fair isn't it? Lol

Where was he dishonest? Double dealing? Not really its a strategic move on their part. In any game say monopoly if I trade my monopoly for Kayleshs monopoly and you still have no monopolies are you going to complain? sure but Kaylesh and I have done nothing wrong

Lol I guess we should agree to disagree

He never offered a prize split though. Rules are as long as you don't offer reward you're good.

See in the article where he mentions that it's a good thing to be on the good side of a pro?  And it's only fair that people pros like get good things?

There's a $20 bill in my pocket. I'm going to put it on the table and the next person who is nice to me gets it. It's a nice thing to concede.

Do you want to concede to me?  No, the $20 isn't a reward for conceding, it's totally unrelated. Jerez.

And Wizard why doesn't E Fro deserve the top 8 he battled just as hard and had the better breakers so why shouldn't he get the spot? That's only fair isn't it? Lol

Except if he didn't get into the top 8, he didn't deserve it, did he?

Where was he dishonest?

Would that rant even have existed had he won that match?  I'd bet not. And that's being dishonest.

He never offered a prize for concession though.

At that point in time he deserved top 8 going into one of the last rounds with his record and breakers should have been enough to get there. He lost (fair and square) but he still deserved a top 8 spot.

And knowing E Fro, not personally, but through past articles, and even random interviews lol E Fro writes that in his article regardless of a win or loss

If one person gets in someone else doesn't, why is he more entitled than the person who got in because his opponent didn't concede

If you can tell me why the person who got in, instead of fro worked less hard than I'll agree with you.