Jobs

[MuggyWuggy]

It's the baby boomers fault for reproducing.

[Wingnut]

Now to the reason welfare programs are so broken. Welfare programs started in the mid 1900's and were going fine...until the Vietnam conflict broke out. After John F. Kennedy died, the new president Lyndon B. Johnson instead of pulling out, decided to go in full force, diverting money away from social welfare programs and because the programs never really got full funding, they never did their full job.

Welfare programs are broken by design. They assume people are not greedy, which is not true. If people were not greedy and just take from the welfare programs what they need, as in theory, all would be fine. The problem is, people are greedy and when they see opportunity to enrich themselves at the expense of others, they will do so. The other problem is, welfare programs are designed to help people who are needy. It is not possible to verify whether their needs are true or whether they come from greed and laziness. That is why all welfare programs and all forms of socialism and communism fail in the long run. They never go fine.

On top of that we have a little bit of a moral problem here. To pay for welfare programs you have to extort money from someone first. The goal is to help the needy people, which is noble and glorious, but the means to reach this goal is extortion of money at gunpoint. This is a nono under iMtG law, and any compatible ethics.

Now I don't always agree with Piotr (although always respect this is his forum so he deserves respect), but I feel you sir are spot on in your post's. although unemployment benefits are in theory good, people abuse it. When you have a safety net you are not afraid to fall, in this case you are not afraid of loosing your job. Therefore the people that don't work hard have no incentive TOO work hard. This inflates unemployment, taking money out of the pockets of people who may have paid a person with that money. Now I'm not bashing anyone "in a bind" closing the knot with welfare, but let be realistic, a lot of people don't want to do poo and let everyone else take care of them. Like the McDonald's workers on strike because they want $14 an hour, do what the rest of us did, obtain a skill set worth a good wage and then get paid. Sorry, I'm done.

[Piotr]

Makes more sense now, thanks.

[Piotr]

I don't always agree with Piotr

Tell me more please

[Wingnut]

I don't always agree with Piotr

Tell me more please

Honestly nothing in particular, I just remember there being a thread a few months back that I agreed that we disageed, that's all. Don't remember the situation( I'm 99% sure it was political, not that I'm a real political person).

[EvACiDe]

The military is always hiring! :3 I joined the Marine Corps a few years ago and now I'm reaping the educational rewards and make enough money from that to not need a job at the moment.

Also, aren't the majority of jobs Obama has "created" part time jobs that don't pay enough for people to support their families?

I'm also not into .politics. at all so everything is just hearsay to me.. Haha

Of course they are always hiring, have you seen our defense budget? It's sickening.

There was a period of time where we weren't getting paid.. A very tiny fraction of that budget actually goes to the average Marine/Soldier/Squid/Chairman

I was actually kidding about them hiring, they're actually trying to kick as many people out as they can because they're losing so much money

Yeah, idk I'm just a giant hippie who thinks we don't need to spend so much $$ on defense and guns while we ignore education and healthcare. 😥

The price we pay for the greatest military :/

[Double-O-Scotch]

Yup. The "greatest military" with the worst public support.

[Piotr]

No worries, you will need the military to protect you from the public... no, wait! Oh.

[Wingnut]

No worries, you will need the military to protect you from the public... no, wait! Oh.

So much truth right there.

[Agrus Kos, Enforcer of Truth]

Yup. The "greatest military" with the worst public support.

Maybe if we weren't fighting unnecessary wars in countries that don't want our help and playing "planetary superhero" all the time the military would have more support.

[Wingnut]

Yup. The "greatest military" with the worst public support.

Maybe if we weren't fighting unnecessary wars in countries that don't want our help and playing "planetary superhero" all the time the military would have more support.

It's not the militaries decision to be there, they are simply pawns being used for political gains. Try not to forget that in theory we are there because of terrorism and the future prevention of it. No, they do not want us there, who would? But the same people who are asking how 9/11 could happen are the same people complaining that we should not be at war. (Mind you, I agree that we've been there for a LONG time without solid proof of progress and I am by no means justifying the majority of the actions of the US government).

[Double-O-Scotch]

Yup. The "greatest military" with the worst public support.

Maybe if we weren't fighting unnecessary wars in countries that don't want our help and playing "planetary superhero" all the time the military would have more support.

It's not the militaries decision to be there, they are simply pawns being used for political gains. Try not to forget that in theory we are there because of terrorism and the future prevention of it. No, they do not want us there, who would? But the same people who are asking how 9/11 could happen are the same people complaining that we should not be at war. (Mind you, I agree that we've been there for a LONG time without solid proof of progress and I am by no means justifying the majority of the actions of the US government).

Ya, good idea. Cause there is no justification. Just ulterior motives, lies and excuses

[Wingnut]

Yup. The "greatest military" with the worst public support.

Maybe if we weren't fighting unnecessary wars in countries that don't want our help and playing "planetary superhero" all the time the military would have more support.

It's not the militaries decision to be there, they are simply pawns being used for political gains. Try not to forget that in theory we are there because of terrorism and the future prevention of it. No, they do not want us there, who would? But the same people who are asking how 9/11 could happen are the same people complaining that we should not be at war. (Mind you, I agree that we've been there for a LONG time without solid proof of progress and I am by no means justifying the majority of the actions of the US government).

Ya, good idea. Cause there is no justification. Just ulterior motives, lies and excuses

Oh I absolutely think that there has been justification. I 100% believe that we should have gone there and that it was needed. I just hope that the loss of respect from other countries, money and most of all lives of our brothers and sisters turns out to have been successful and worth it. That's all. I just hope our leaders created the best plan of action and it creates the results we wanted.

[Double-O-Scotch]

"War is the greatest plague to affect humanity. It destroys lives, it destroys families, and it destroys nations. Any scourge is preferable to it."
~Martin Luther.

[Langku]

I had never thought of Piotr's perspective that welfare assumes people are NOT greedy. I always assumed there were welfare programs because capitalists WERE by nature too greedy to share. For me welfare was insurance against a great many people languishing as a result of the greed of a powerful few who monopolized the goods and services. A friend of mine argued against government run social programs (the context was education in particular but this applies to welfare, UNEMPLOYMENT, medical, etc). It would be interesting to see what would fill the void were the government to stop "extorting" the populous for such programs and left social services to the private sector. I would like to believe Piotr is right that people, when left to their own devices, would help others out.

I'm feeling uppity. Maybe I'll skip paying taxes and support a charity, an invalid, a soldier, a school, and a construction site and see if my government will accept it as fair trade.