The thread in which you discuss Obama and current American .politics. ...

[Aladormax]

I personally believe that we should have the right to own guns, but that millitary grade weapons should be illegal to own. There should also be more stringent checks on buying a gun, and what type. Hunting is a legal use for a gun, and if done for food has no wrong attached. You also as of now can own guns for self defense. There is nothing wrong with having a small caliber pistol for either personal or home defense in unsafe areas. Having been exposed to guns when I was slightly younger to teach me about safety, I will argue the point that if used properly guns can be as safe as any other potential weapon with proper training.

[Wingnut]

I personally believe that we should have the right to own guns, but that millitary grade weapons should be illegal to own. There should also be more stringent checks on buying a gun, and what type. Hunting is a legal use for a gun, and if done for food has no wrong attached. You also as of now can own guns for self defense. There is nothing wrong with having a small caliber pistol for either personal or home defense in unsafe areas. Having been exposed to guns when I was slightly younger to teach me about safety, I will argue the point that if used properly guns can be as safe as any other potential weapon with proper training.

Completely agreed, but want to throw out that military grade weapons although not illegal to own, are EXTREMELY expensive and EXTREMELY difficult to own. 99.9% of "assault rifles" civilians own are not military grade as they are semi auto vs burst or full auto. To purchase a full auto weapon you are looking at upwards $6k-10k to legally own between gun purchase and licensing. Sorry, to be "that guy", I just wanted to back you up a little just incase. But I completely agree though, having also been taught at a young age about gun safety.

[Apathy Reactor]

I personally believe that we should have the right to own guns, but that millitary grade weapons should be illegal to own. There should also be more stringent checks on buying a gun, and what type. Hunting is a legal use for a gun, and if done for food has no wrong attached. You also as of now can own guns for self defense. There is nothing wrong with having a small caliber pistol for either personal or home defense in unsafe areas. Having been exposed to guns when I was slightly younger to teach me about safety, I will argue the point that if used properly guns can be as safe as any other potential weapon with proper training.

I agree, assault weapons such as MG's and such should not be available to the public, but hunting rifles? Small arms for self defense such as pistols? These are not tools for murder, they are tools for aquiring food, sport, and self defense. Any tool can be misused, a baseball bat or a bomb or a generator and a puddle of water can be used to murder someone as well as a gun. The problem is not the tool, the problem is those who would misuse it.

[DrEggman789]

I am Obama neutral.

Voted for him the first time because, at the time, I was a centrist politically. In 2012 I didn't vote for him because I am now very liberal. I voted Stein.

On the guns issue - Norway. Owning a gun there is next to impossible, unless you hunt for a living. Violent crime is next to nil. I read somewhere that something 60% of Norways's crime is petty theft, and it's usually bicycles.

Of course, they also don't have high income inequality and poverty, so not a lot of desire to commit crime.

(Note: I don't support outlawing guns. Ideally, I would, but the way out laws and society is presently, it would never work. I also own two firearms. No particular reason. I don't hunt, and my faith prohibits harming a person, even in self defence. They were my dad's, and I guess I don't want to let go of them.)

[Kaworu, the Fifth Child]

Guns are just a different way to do it.  If someone wants to kill someone, they will accomplish it with or without guns.  people have survived several gunshots in a row.  There's a police officer in my state that took a shotgun blast to the head and survived just fine.  Guns aren't some crazy easy way to kill someone.

Btw you have an about 1/10 chance of surviving a headshot directly to the head, a man a few decades ago survived 10 bullets right to the head by firing squad, and you only die by headshot (besides all that bleedin out stuff) is if it hits a more central part of your brain. If they hit another part it's not neccesarily death. The more you know

[Necromancerman]

Obama to me was the good choice when I was a demo, but now that I'm a socialist I just see him as a lesser of two evils
Modify, also please people it's the affordable healthcare act NOT obamacare

[DrEggman789]

I'm with Necro.

[Apathy Reactor]

Obama to me was the good choice when I was a demo, but now that I'm a socialist I just see him as a lesser of two evils
Modify, also please people it's the affordable healthcare act NOT obamacare

^This guy knows where it's at:
http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc484/Dios_Patria_Rey73/redflagbig2.gif

[Necromancerman]

I'm with Necro.

Thank you doctor

[Piotr]

Lol

[DirtyMustachio]

All these topics turn out the exact same way.

Every one of you use the exact same arguments as you did the last time, and everyone is on or around generally the same stance as they were before.

It peeves me a little.

I will ring in on one thing though.

Murder and self defense.
Generally what everyone seems to get all mixed up and in debate over isn't general murder, but MASS murder.

And generally speaking it takes a semi/automatic rifle or handgun of sorts or other means to kill as many people as possible in the shortest amount of time.

And banning all guns will prevent this??

What!? No... These are isolated incidents, conceived most of the time with obscene calculation.

Murder is completely separate and usually has a personal motive, and for whatever reason they do what they do, they will pick the best tool available to them at the time, be it gun, bat, knife etc.. Generally handguns. Same could be said for self defense. I carry concealed so if someone were to choose me to be a murder victim, at least I have the option of matching with equal force.

Mass murder isn't a target of personal agenda.
Mass murder is based on a psychopathic attempt to realize some sort of statement or sheer insanity. The method will be used on whatever means is most appropriate, be that bomb, gun, leading a cult to drink poison.
^but these incidents will happen no matter what you take away.

Or perhaps we should ban planes so no one can crash them into any other large buildings...

[Apathy Reactor]

Obama to me was the good choice when I was a demo, but now that I'm a socialist I just see him as a lesser of two evils
Modify, also please people it's the affordable healthcare act NOT obamacare

^This guy knows where it's at:
http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc484/Dios_Patria_Rey73/redflagbig2.gif

Rule number one of posting images: if they distort the screen, don't use them.

I'm preeeeeeeeety sure that isn't a rule....

[MuggyWuggy]

Whoa whoa whoa buddy: let's not discuss rules in this thread about the forum.

-You can start another thread for that.

-This thread is for political jargon that clogs up other threads.

[Wingnut]

Yeah, let's keep this to political arguments that no is going to bend on and/or be open minded about gentleman. Jeesh.

[DrEggman789]

I am Obama neutral.

Voted for him the first time because, at the time, I was a centrist politically. In 2012 I didn't vote for him because I am now very liberal. I voted Stein.

On the guns issue - Norway. Owning a gun there is next to impossible, unless you hunt for a living. Violent crime is next to nil. I read somewhere that something 60% of Norways's crime is petty theft, and it's usually bicycles.

Of course, they also don't have high income inequality and poverty, so not a lot of desire to commit crime.

(Note: I don't support outlawing guns. Ideally, I would, but the way out laws and society is presently, it would never work. I also own two firearms. No particular reason. I don't hunt, and my faith prohibits harming a person, even in self defence. They were my dad's, and I guess I don't want to let go of them.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anders_Behring_Breivik

Norway what?

Haha people love to bring that up.

One event. Three years ago. You know how long it takes in the US for that many people (77) to die from firearms? Less than three days. US gun rates are 10.26 per 100,000. Norway's is 1.78 per 100,000. Don't imply they are comparable.