Deep Sea Milling💀

[abstractApathist]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

[DeathlyFoiend]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

[abstractApathist]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

[DeathlyFoiend]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

If you're talking about a budget, yes they are cheap, but in the game they are not. I would rather spend two life on something only for that time. If you are going to be using a painland, you are going to use the color ability more than twice in the game. If you're not, then you either have better lands and shouldn't be playing it all anyways or you're running artifacts but why would you run a painland over something like a basic land? Because it gives you two colors? There are better options in general. The 2 life is better at one time, then wasting it over time moreso than anything. If you constantly give away 1 life for a color, aggro decks have a better advantage against you while a shockland only deals two and nothing more.

[Byerley121]

Another thing to consider is that shock lands such as  {Hallowed Fountain} act as both a plains and an island card which trigger 2010-2013 lands and  {Farseek} where  {Underground River} does neither.

[DeathlyFoiend]

Another thing to consider is that shock lands such as  {Hallowed Fountain} act as both a plains and an island card which trigger 2010-2013 lands and  {Farseek} where  {Underground River} does neither.

Usually better to consider that If you think of Zendikar Fetchlands like {Marsh Flats}

[IntoFire]

 {Liliana of the Dark Realms} and {Mind Grind}
would be lovely.

[InfinitiveDivinity]

{Liliana of the Dark Realms} and {Mind Grind}
would be lovely.

The idea is pretty sweet for sure, but in all honesty it's a little too slow.

[abstractApathist]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

If you're talking about a budget, yes they are cheap, but in the game they are not. I would rather spend two life on something only for that time. If you are going to be using a painland, you are going to use the color ability more than twice in the game. If you're not, then you either have better lands and shouldn't be playing it all anyways or you're running artifacts but why would you run a painland over something like a basic land? Because it gives you two colors? There are better options in general. The 2 life is better at one time, then wasting it over time moreso than anything. If you constantly give away 1 life for a color, aggro decks have a better advantage against you while a shockland only deals two and nothing more.

While I wholeheartedly agree that shocklands are better, I was never suggesting using painlands in their place. I was saying I'd prefer painlands to M12 dual-lands in a deck like this with so few islands/swamps.

[DeathlyFoiend]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

If you're talking about a budget, yes they are cheap, but in the game they are not. I would rather spend two life on something only for that time. If you are going to be using a painland, you are going to use the color ability more than twice in the game. If you're not, then you either have better lands and shouldn't be playing it all anyways or you're running artifacts but why would you run a painland over something like a basic land? Because it gives you two colors? There are better options in general. The 2 life is better at one time, then wasting it over time moreso than anything. If you constantly give away 1 life for a color, aggro decks have a better advantage against you while a shockland only deals two and nothing more.

While I wholeheartedly agree that shocklands are better, I was never suggesting using painlands in their place. I was saying I'd prefer painlands to M12 dual-lands in a deck like this with so few islands/swamps.

M10s are still better than Painlands.

[abstractApathist]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

If you're talking about a budget, yes they are cheap, but in the game they are not. I would rather spend two life on something only for that time. If you are going to be using a painland, you are going to use the color ability more than twice in the game. If you're not, then you either have better lands and shouldn't be playing it all anyways or you're running artifacts but why would you run a painland over something like a basic land? Because it gives you two colors? There are better options in general. The 2 life is better at one time, then wasting it over time moreso than anything. If you constantly give away 1 life for a color, aggro decks have a better advantage against you while a shockland only deals two and nothing more.

While I wholeheartedly agree that shocklands are better, I was never suggesting using painlands in their place. I was saying I'd prefer painlands to M12 dual-lands in a deck like this with so few islands/swamps.

M10s are still better than Painlands.

In a deck like this with so few islands/swamps, I think that painlands work better. In the end, it's a matter of opinion...

[DeathlyFoiend]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

If you're talking about a budget, yes they are cheap, but in the game they are not. I would rather spend two life on something only for that time. If you are going to be using a painland, you are going to use the color ability more than twice in the game. If you're not, then you either have better lands and shouldn't be playing it all anyways or you're running artifacts but why would you run a painland over something like a basic land? Because it gives you two colors? There are better options in general. The 2 life is better at one time, then wasting it over time moreso than anything. If you constantly give away 1 life for a color, aggro decks have a better advantage against you while a shockland only deals two and nothing more.

While I wholeheartedly agree that shocklands are better, I was never suggesting using painlands in their place. I was saying I'd prefer painlands to M12 dual-lands in a deck like this with so few islands/swamps.

M10s are still better than Painlands.

In a deck like this with so few islands/swamps, I think that painlands work better. In the end, it's a matter of opinion...

Not at all. Painlands have more of a susceptible build to burn, hits, attack, hate. M10 hold you back a turn but have a stronger outcome and don't open you up as much.

[abstractApathist]

What about {Underground River}? It only shocks you when you need color.

Don't ever suggest those even if you think it is good. Those cards are usually the worse, you never would run it unless you are desperate.

Why? They are less expensive than shocklands and don't enter tapped.

If you're talking about a budget, yes they are cheap, but in the game they are not. I would rather spend two life on something only for that time. If you are going to be using a painland, you are going to use the color ability more than twice in the game. If you're not, then you either have better lands and shouldn't be playing it all anyways or you're running artifacts but why would you run a painland over something like a basic land? Because it gives you two colors? There are better options in general. The 2 life is better at one time, then wasting it over time moreso than anything. If you constantly give away 1 life for a color, aggro decks have a better advantage against you while a shockland only deals two and nothing more.

While I wholeheartedly agree that shocklands are better, I was never suggesting using painlands in their place. I was saying I'd prefer painlands to M12 dual-lands in a deck like this with so few islands/swamps.

M10s are still better than Painlands.

In a deck like this with so few islands/swamps, I think that painlands work better. In the end, it's a matter of opinion...

Not at all. Painlands have more of a susceptible build to burn, hits, attack, hate. M10 hold you back a turn but have a stronger outcome and don't open you up as much.

That turn of not milling can easily get you outraced by most modern decks, a lot more so than 2 or 3 life can.

[InfinitiveDivinity]

If {Drowned Catacomb} isn't my first land, it pretty much never comes in tapped. The fetches and normal land draws ensure I get my colors. If I don't have Blue accessible, I don't have an {Island}, and I kept a bad hand.

Painlands are a nuisance for the most part, they have their uses for sure, but they're not that good in here. Also I'm running 4 {Black Sun's Zenith}, I can keep up with most Aggro decks with those and {Echoing Truth}, especially Game 2.

[IntoFire]

M10s and Shocklands work well together since the Shocklands have the "Basic" land types as their subtypes thus getting the M10s untapped if you already have the sh