Debate thread.

Quote from: Birdbrain on May 05, 2013, 10:34:03 PM

Quote from: FlickerYourOwnIdentity on May 05, 2013, 10:31:19 PM

I wish credit card companies would stop sending you spam mail, it annoys the hell out of me.

you could always send THEM spam mail in return

Doesn't help, already tried.

lol

Quote from: Dudecore on May 05, 2013, 03:18:29 PM

What socialist things did Obama do exactly that Bush hasn't? He hasn't relinquished his emergency powers, he hasn't gotten rid of the Patriot act, he continues a wars AND started another, he supports Israel, he bails out capitalists, still continues the crony capitalist things, kills people for absolutely no reason, violate the Geneva conventions, drone strikes on innocent children and people. What else? Raise taxes? Confiscate rich people's money? Forces new regulations?

Hey I support Isreal, Obama supports Syria too, who he also gave money too, who was Harboring Osama Bin Ladin.

I never said Bush was a good president, in fact he really wasn't.  Obama is ten times worse.  At least Bush had class.

If you want to compare Obama to a good president, compare him to Ronald Reagan.

Bush couldn't spell "class", he probably needed someone to tie his shoes.

Just my opinion, but Fox News is almost always pushing an agenda. They are actually hard to watch.

If you think Americas financial problems do not have something to do with the one percent, than you are truly delusional. Regan did some good things...25+ years ago! Times have changed. Bush screwed the population and entered a war inwhich we had no business being involved. He set us so far back it's pathetic. And now congress works against everything the Pres wants just to keep lobbyists and the uber rich happy.

Ronald Reagan... *sigh* why can't we have another Ronald Reagan?

And now congress works against everything the Pres wants

And rightly so because the Pres is trying to implement socialism.

Socialism is an evil thing, indeed. It violates all the basic natural laws and ethics, starting with 'goal does not justify the means'. It is absurdly inefficient as an economic system, it demoralises the population by growing the 'needy' class. It ends in tears every single time it is implemented anywhere on the planet, yet there are hordes of people naive enough to believe that socialism is a good thing. Or maybe they are not naive, just crooks?

Quote from: Piotr on May 05, 2013, 08:18:05 PM

Quote from: Xaol on May 05, 2013, 07:50:05 PM

Quote from: Birdbrain on May 05, 2013, 07:35:11 PM

Part of the problem of course, is politicians wining and dinning lawmakers to get them to make laws that benefit them. The upper class is being catered to, while the middle and lower classes are out in the back alley digging for scraps In the garbage cans.

Meanwhile. The government is stupidly printing more money to pay for there debt. Which is putting them deeper into debt. Like paying for a credit card with another credit card. And using the second credit card to pay for the first...

Not quite how the US money system works. While the US is constantly printing money through the FED, it's taking out money at the same time. Why? To battle inflation. The bills which are destroyed are ones which are worn out or ripped. New ones are printed to replace them; the Fed determines at what rate money is created and destroyed, and it has nothing to do with fixing the debt. Rather, the Fed bases the ratio off of the perceived best way to battle inflation. Not to mention, printing more money to reduce the debt would only scale the debt to match the jump in inflation rates.

Do you know what is the rate at which the money is printed and at which it is destroyed?

No idea. I'm not sure if that is privatised information or common knowledge. I'll try and look it up. I know the rate changes constantly.

I'll help you with that: it is destroyed at insignificant rate and it is printed at stupidly high rate, so your claim is false and BB is quite correct in his view of how the money system in US works.

Quote from: Xaol on May 05, 2013, 09:16:30 PM

Quote from: Piotr on May 05, 2013, 08:18:05 PM

Quote from: Xaol on May 05, 2013, 07:50:05 PM

Quote from: Birdbrain on May 05, 2013, 07:35:11 PM

Part of the problem of course, is politicians wining and dinning lawmakers to get them to make laws that benefit them. The upper class is being catered to, while the middle and lower classes are out in the back alley digging for scraps In the garbage cans.

Meanwhile. The government is stupidly printing more money to pay for there debt. Which is putting them deeper into debt. Like paying for a credit card with another credit card. And using the second credit card to pay for the first...

Not quite how the US money system works. While the US is constantly printing money through the FED, it's taking out money at the same time. Why? To battle inflation. The bills which are destroyed are ones which are worn out or ripped. New ones are printed to replace them; the Fed determines at what rate money is created and destroyed, and it has nothing to do with fixing the debt. Rather, the Fed bases the ratio off of the perceived best way to battle inflation. Not to mention, printing more money to reduce the debt would only scale the debt to match the jump in inflation rates.

Do you know what is the rate at which the money is printed and at which it is destroyed?

No idea. I'm not sure if that is privatised information or common knowledge. I'll try and look it up. I know the rate changes constantly.

I'll help you with that: it is destroyed at insignificant rate and it is printed at stupidly high rate, so your claim is false and BB is quite correct in his view of how the money system in US works.

Not quite. I did a bit of research, actually. It seems that the rate our money is destroyed at annually is shown here, by the Fed itself:
www.moneyfac.....figures.html
Their statistic shows that 8.4 billion notes were printed in 2012.
Our rate of bill destruction? In 2010, it was:
"In 2010, [the Fed's] cash offices destroyed 5.95 billion notes"
From m.theatlanti.....-how/236990/

So with inflation rates of 1.5% currently (see www.tradinge.....nflation-cpi) I'm having trouble understanding how the US is printing money to pay for its debt. If they were, we wouldn't have interest rates nearly as low; in fact, to cover our debt, we'd essentially have inflation so high it would be like post WW1 Germany.

Don't bother with objective facts. Piotr dismisses as irrelevant them when they run divergent to his point of view.

Really? We will see.

Xaol. The only reason it isn't so high is because oil is payed for around the world in dollars. Which countries are gradually working to change

Xaol. The only reason it isn't so high is because oil is payed for around the world in dollars. Which countries are gradually working to change

Do you mind elaborating a bit more? I'm not quite sure I understand.

In order to buy oil, other countries have to convert there currency into dollars to buy it. This of course, is holding up the value of the dollar. If all other countries stop doing this, however (which they are). The value of the dollar will CRASH beyond repair

This of course. Will lead to rioting and faithless looting and eventually force the nation into Marshall law

May I point out we have a debt the likes of which is FAR beyond anyone could have imagined 50 years ago

._. I got nothing to debate, would someone like to debate in a respectful manner upon the happenings of some interesting and controversial thing?