Trades

[Nissassagame]

There is not an economical way to track a package shipped from Canada to the US.

I don't see how that is pertinent. If you didn't ship your cards when you said you would, that's lying, and dishonest.

Is that what happened?

It is exactly what happened.

[Nissassagame]

As recommended, I tried to handle this using PM but was constantly brought back to the thread. As far as forum law is concerned, there is a very clear message regarding lying and Infinitive without a doubt lied to me. I don't know what constitutes as punishment but letting it slide because he's a longer standing member does not send a good message to anyone. I attempted to resolve by requesting that we just send our parts of the agreed upon deal last night and was told to keep my cards and he'd send me a Thrun to "shut me up" and that I was win-win. Again, I disagree, as this was not the AGREED upon deal. I lose the other cards he agreed to trade me. No matter what, Infinitive is insistent that this not go down in a fair manner. I also believe that he's been around long enough to know that this whole thing is in very poor taste. I apologize for being harsh but I did not call him out or mention his name until another member advised me that he brought this issue to light and continued to do so after nyghthawk and dude core recommended we handle through PM, which I did and he did not.

[Piotr]

Infinitive wasnt trying to disappear or steal cards, he just made a poor decision(s) in my opinion.

Did he break the law?

According to one person, he did.

According to evidence, including his own statements, did or did not he break the law?

I understand the actions that were taken against ericlay because there was no denying that he was trying to rip people off and blatantly lying to them. But this is completely different. While what infinitive did was arguably douchey, I don't know if I would motion to subject him to punishment. It seems extreme.

I wasn't asking you about the punishment, as this is logically a domain of the victim, I was merely asking whether the law was broken. This question has only two answers and both are extreme ;)

[Moneekahh]

Infinitive wasnt trying to disappear or steal cards, he just made a poor decision(s) in my opinion.

Did he break the law?

According to one person, he did.

According to evidence, including his own statements, did or did not he break the law?

I understand the actions that were taken against ericlay because there was no denying that he was trying to rip people off and blatantly lying to them. But this is completely different. While what infinitive did was arguably douchey, I don't know if I would motion to subject him to punishment. It seems extreme.

I wasn't asking you about the punishment, as this is logically a domain of the victim, I was merely asking whether the law was broken. This question has only two answers and both are extreme ;)

I must have missed the post where he said he lied. He did break the law. :(

[Piotr]

Infinitive wasnt trying to disappear or steal cards, he just made a poor decision(s) in my opinion.

Did he break the law?

He didn't send the cards the day he told nissa he was going to and he tried to renegotiate the deal. That was in poor taste imo. When it was brought to light here, he said he would make it right. If he does so, I don't see it necessary to crucify him. Was it right? No. Like I said, poor decisions. He wasn't going anywhere though and if he makes it right I would think lesson learned and the community will understand that you don't try to renegotiate a deal after its been finalized and addresses exchanged.

That should be part of the trade law and clear.

This is not clear to me. Did he break the law?

[Piotr]

As recommended, I tried to handle this using PM but was constantly brought back to the thread. As far as forum law is concerned, there is a very clear message regarding lying and Infinitive without a doubt lied to me. I don't know what constitutes as punishment (...).

Whom do you delegate your punishment rights to?

EDIT: Punishment, according to iMtG Law, must be logical.

[Nissassagame]

As recommended, I tried to handle this using PM but was constantly brought back to the thread. As far as forum law is concerned, there is a very clear message regarding lying and Infinitive without a doubt lied to me. I don't know what constitutes as punishment (...).

Whom do you delegate your punishment rights to?

EDIT: Punishment, according to iMtG Law, must be logical.

He admitted in this thread that he lied about sending his end of the deal. He changed the sending terms without any notice. I checked the mail for weeks and was told eventually that he'd not sent his end and on top of it, wanted the renegotiate the deal because of Thrun's new pricing. As far as trying to change terms after everything was agreed upon, I'm not sure if it breaks law or is just classless. I would hope you make a decision here.

[Piotr]

As recommended, I tried to handle this using PM but was constantly brought back to the thread. As far as forum law is concerned, there is a very clear message regarding lying and Infinitive without a doubt lied to me. I don't know what constitutes as punishment (...).

Whom do you delegate your punishment rights to?

EDIT: Punishment, according to iMtG Law, must be logical.

He admitted in this thread that he lied about sending his end of the deal. He changed the sending terms without any notice. I checked the mail for weeks and was told eventually that he'd not sent his end and on top of it, wanted the renegotiate the deal because of Thrun's new pricing. As far as trying to change terms after everything was agreed upon, I'm not sure if it breaks law or is just classless. I would hope you make a decision here.

As a potential victim you already stated that he is guilty, I merely asked you about punishment you would like to see dealt. Do you want to do it yourself or delegate it to me or anyone else?

[Nissassagame]

As recommended, I tried to handle this using PM but was constantly brought back to the thread. As far as forum law is concerned, there is a very clear message regarding lying and Infinitive without a doubt lied to me. I don't know what constitutes as punishment (...).

Whom do you delegate your punishment rights to?

EDIT: Punishment, according to iMtG Law, must be logical.

He admitted in this thread that he lied about sending his end of the deal. He changed the sending terms without any notice. I checked the mail for weeks and was told eventually that he'd not sent his end and on top of it, wanted the renegotiate the deal because of Thrun's new pricing. As far as trying to change terms after everything was agreed upon, I'm not sure if it breaks law or is just classless. I would hope you make a decision here.

As a potential victim you already stated that he is guilty, I merely asked you about punishment you would like to see dealt. Do you want to do it yourself or delegate it to me or anyone else?

I would delegate to you Piotr. As far as making a decision on what it should be, I would rather put that to someone like yourself who has a better idea on what is fitting.

[Piotr]

To me, -20 karma is fitting. Happy?

[Nissassagame]

To me, -20 karma is fitting. Happy?

Agreed

[Piotr]

By iMtG law I find InfinitiveDivinity guilty of lying and breach of contract.

I punish InfinitiveDivinity with 20 negative karma.

InfinitiveDivinity is not guilty, case closed.

[Piotr]

InfinitiveDivinity is not guilty, case closed.

This does in no way prevent you from opening another case, such as 'you vs. judge'.

Be aware that false accusation is a rather bad form of lying.