Increasing Vengeance

[Double-O-Scotch]

Actually it's 3. The initial spell, the reverberate and the copy it makes. It's only 2 spells cast, but its 3 spells.

[Birdbrain]

I didnt bother to read to closely, so sorry if this was already mentioned, casting and copying are to very different things. If you cast {unsummon} and {reverberate} you have cast two spells, {reverberate} and other copy spells only count as one spell even when they resolve.

{increasing vengeance} says you can copy target spell twice from flashback

Whats your point? Copying still isnt casting.

I fail to see how that matters

[Wackaman9001]

In the rulings, it says something about modal spells (ex. Spells with choose one) and copying those modes. I think the cast from GY is a mode and each time you copy it it replicates that condition of flashback for double copy

[Coffee Vampire]

It seems that way but it is not a mode. Just google it it is a common question asked all over the internet. Not trying to say you are dumb or anything, just citing the internet

Well this topic was resolved in the fourth post by Maximo...no you cannot use increasing vengeance twice from your hand to get infinite storm, cause storm checks how many spells you cast, not how many were put onto the stack.

RESOLVED, +1 maximo

[Birdbrain]

Why does it say "copy that spell twice instead" when it's cast from the graveyard?

[Kaleo42]

Why does it say "copy that spell twice instead" when it's cast from the graveyard?

Because that is it's effect. If you cast {lightning bolt} and then {increasing vengeance} from you hand then it copies the bolt making two bolts on the stack. If you flash it back instead then you get 3 bolts on the stack. No matter what you only cast to spells so a grape shot will only copy twice.

[Birdbrain]

Why does it say "copy that spell twice instead" when it's cast from the graveyard?

Because that is it's effect. If you cast {lightning bolt} and then {increasing vengeance} from you hand then it copies the bolt making two bolts on the stack. If you flash it back instead then you get 3 bolts on the stack. No matter what you only cast to spells so a grape shot will only copy twice.

so what if you cast an {increasing vengeance} from the graveyard on an {increasing vengeance} from the graveyard. That is what I was talking about

[Coffee Vampire]

You will get to copy a spell up to 4 times.
You get two copies from flashed back vengeance. You get 2 more from copying it twice with other flashed back vengeance.

The reason you don't get 4 from the second one is you didn't cast the flashed back copy from the graveyard; you just copied it. It doesn't make much logical sense but that's how it is.

To provide a more simple example with the same components, say you flashed back {Increasing Confusion} for 1. So your opponent will mill 2 (1*2). Now you copy it with increasing vengeance. Your opponent will only mill 1 more. Not 2 more. This is because when you copied the increasing confusion, the game said: "did he cast it from the graveyard? Nope, he didn't cast it at all, it's just a copy created on the stack. His opponent only mills 1, because x =1."

Does that help make sense?

[Birdbrain]

You will get to copy a spell up to 4 times.
You get two copies from flashed back vengeance. You get 2 more from copying it twice with other flashed back vengeance.

The reason you don't get 4 from the second one is you didn't cast the flashed back copy from the graveyard; you just copied it. It doesn't make much logical sense but that's how it is.

To provide a more simple example with the same components, say you flashed back {Increasing Confusion} for 1. So your opponent will mill 2 (1*2). Now you copy it with increasing vengeance. Your opponent will only mill 1 more. Not 2 more. This is because when you copied the increasing confusion, the game said: "did he cast it from the graveyard? Nope, he didn't cast it at all, it's just a copy created on the stack. His opponent only mills 1, because x =1."

Does that help make sense?

the simpler explanation wasn't needed

[Coffee Vampire]

Glad I could help

[Birdbrain]

Glad I could help

Isn't that what this community is for? And This is my last post in this thread unless it gets revived again with some twist

[Double-O-Scotch]

It's a conspiracy that goes all the way to the top