Intense copying questions

Started by FireCrafted, February 12, 2014, 02:09:50 PM

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FireCrafted

say I have {Sakashima the impostor} in my hand. {Lazav, dimir mastermind} is on the battlefield under my control currently as himself. I play Sakashima and he enters as a copy of lazav but still with the name Sakashima and the bounce ability as well as lazavs hex proof and grave copy ability.

At this point they do not bomb each other, but if a creature my opponent controls were sent to the grave and both lazav and Sakashima became a copy of that creature, would they then bomb? Sakashima's name appears on the card text to only keep the name as he enters the field, while lazavs text (which is now on the Sakashima in play) says you may have lazav dimir mastermind become a copy of said creature except its name is *still* lazav gains hero of and this ability.

The "name is *still* lazav" even though the name is currently NOT lazav; it's Sakashima the impostor. Would Sakashima's name change to lazav as he used lazavs ability to shapeshift into another creature? Or would he remain Sakashima because the name doesn't change to lazav, it *remains* lazav, which would have no effect if the name was Not lazav. Which it is not.

griffin131

When a card has its name in the rules text, the name is referring to [this card].
In your example, the Lazav and the copy would still each have their separate names.

abstractApathist

#2
Quote from: griffin131 on February 12, 2014, 02:53:24 PM
When a card has its name in the rules text, the name is referring to [this card].
In your example, the Lazav and the copy would still each have their separate names.
This is correct.

CR 201.4b. If an ability of an object refers to that object by name, and an object with a different name gains that ability, each instance of the first name in the gained ability that refers to the first object by name should be treated as the second name.

Anywhere on Sakashima that says {Lazav, Dimir Mastermind} actually says {Sakashima, the Impostor}.

Pleeb

Follow-up question: would Sakashima lose his return to owners hand ability when he uses the demir ability because it isn't specifically copied?

abstractApathist

Quote from: Pleeb on February 12, 2014, 08:04:30 PM
Follow-up question: would Sakashima lose his return to owners hand ability when he uses the demir ability because it isn't specifically copied?
Yes, it would lose that ability.

griffin131

Quote from: abstractApathist on February 12, 2014, 04:06:46 PM
Quote from: griffin131 on February 12, 2014, 02:53:24 PM
When a card has its name in the rules text, the name is referring to [this card].
In your example, the Lazav and the copy would still each have their separate names.
This is correct.

CR 201.4b. If an ability of an object refers to that object by name, and an object with a different name gains that ability, each instance of the first name in the gained ability that refers to the first object by name should be treated as the second name.

Anywhere on Sakashima that says {Lazav, Dimir Mastermind} actually says {Sakashima, the Impostor}.
Thanks. I was trying to find that rule but failed.

Sparkle Ninja

Speaking of clones, I finished my {Fated Infatuation} deck today

FireCrafted

Thank you taysby, griffin and abstract for the compliments(?) and for clearing that up. In my {the Mimeoplasm} deck that will actually be a common happening, lazav and Sakashima together.