y do people run these? whats the point of paying 1 life to find a land? mayb its cuz im relitively new, but i dnt understand
Onslaught lands are stupid expensive.
It's just like running a dual land except based on what hand you get you always get the color you need (granted yøū are playing 2 colors) and most dual lands have drawbacks
{root bound crag}
{razor verge thicket}
{bloodstained mire}
The last havin the smallest drawback IMO.
I'm not familiar with some of the other lands, but yøū want flexibility with smallest setback.
In eternal formats (vintage and legacy), they are able to search your library for Shocklands and Dual Lands. 1 life isn't really a big deal because a) how often does a person lose by 1? B) 1 life is a bargain for searching your library and limiting future dead draws
The idea is deck thinning, once you fetch a particular land, your library contains one less card, thus your chances of drawing something in particular is higher.
ahhh, i c... but y not use something like evolving wilds or terramorphic expanse?
Because they search for "basic land". Something like {flooded strand} can find {tundra} or {hallowed fountain}
ok. so then wuts the point of something like hallowed fountain, who wnts 2 pay 2 life just to bring it in untapped, i mean, i can understand turn 1 and mayb 2 potential, but after that whats the point?
Life isn't sacred, it's a resource. Shock lands can be used to aid in tempo, improving your board position and ultimately your chance at winning. If you can't use life has a resource then you're not playing to the fullest potential.
Speed is the name of the game.
i guess its since im a newbie-ish i dnt like loosing life much
Quote from: GoJuDragon on May 07, 2012, 11:32:04 PM
i guess its since im a newbie-ish i dnt like loosing life much
Winning by 1 life or 20 is still a win. Magic is a battle of resources and who controls them.
okay, but still y wuld u wnt 2 pay 2 life on that when u could be using other duals?
Because they contain the words "Island Plains". Other dual lands say "land". They don't say "Basic Land", so you cant search for them with any modern cards.
The shock lands and fetch lands work together, modern duals don't work with anything besides drawing them. Also, you can't guarantee they come in untapped.
ok, that makes since, thx for the help
Quote from: GoJuDragon on May 07, 2012, 11:52:42 PM
ok, that makes since, thx for the help
For all intents and purposes, those cards are crazy expensive and are really only for tournament level players. A $500 card is nothing for someone who could win $1,000's at a tournament. Professional play is like a job, and anything that can give you an edge is worth whatever it costs.
yeah, and iv got another probly dumb question, but whats the point of making a card if it is goin to become banned?
Well they don't know it will be banned until players break and abuse it.
Another answer is money. A card like {Jace, the mind sculptor} was created by WotC to sell an expansion called "Worldwake", and boy did he. He was in 90% of everyone's deck and ruled the playing field. They banned him when the next expansion came out.
ok, i understand the money part but shuld wizards realize the potential for it to become broken and not make it?
Quote from: GoJuDragon on May 08, 2012, 12:11:56 AM
ok, i understand the money part but shuld wizards realize the potential for it to become broken and not make it?
Nope. They need to sell boxes. "Standard" format can be broken for only so long. It's usually 3 months between new boxes, so by the time the next set comes out, they ban the previous sets broken things. Like {Snapcaster Mage} is the villain of this block (Innistrad - Dark Ascension - Avacyn Restored). They tried to fix him in the latest set with {cavern of souls}, but it won't work and just screw everything up going forward. When enough people complain about how grossly overpowered {cavern of souls} makes the standard format, they'll ban it before Magic 2013 comes out.
so y r things like {vault of whispers} and {great furnace} and all those banned in most formats?
They're banned in modern because of "Affinity". Creatures like {frogmite} have affinity, and cost 1 less to cast for each artifact....well they cost 1 less and you can use the artifact lands to pay for the rest. So if you have 2 artifact lands, and 1 {frogmite}, you have -3 casting cost for an artifact, and 2 land. Things get out of hand quickly
It was a busted mechanic from day 1, and WotC just didn't test it at all really.
Sometimes they do stuff thinking "wow this is gonna be great for creature casting!", then it turns out that it allows people to exploit things.
{arcbound ravager} {cranial plating} {disciple of the vault} and any cards with the affinity for artifacts ability
I actually run a dek where it is good to lose life, so I like the fetch land for that. The really provide (I know this was already said) flexibility, it is kind of a control card.
Quote from: Dudecore on May 08, 2012, 12:17:29 AM
Quote from: GoJuDragon on May 08, 2012, 12:11:56 AM
ok, i understand the money part but shuld wizards realize the potential for it to become broken and not make it?
Nope. They need to sell boxes. "Standard" format can be broken for only so long. It's usually 3 months between new boxes, so by the time the next set comes out, they ban the previous sets broken things. Like {Snapcaster Mage} is the villain of this block (Innistrad - Dark Ascension - Avacyn Restored). They tried to fix him in the latest set with {cavern of souls}, but it won't work and just screw everything up going forward. When enough people complain about how grossly overpowered {cavern of souls} makes the standard format, they'll ban it before Magic 2013 comes out.
WotC knows when they are putting out stuff with high power potential. What they don't want to see is a stagnant, unfun environment. They really don't like banning cards, but when nearly every top deck in the tournaments looks the same (see "Caw-blade"), is too easy to get working consistently ({Stoneforge Mystic} searching for and then playing {Batterskull} by turn three}) leads to players complaining about the game environment, or meta.
So really quickly... Back to the fetching lands thingy... Are there any current standard cards that allow for easy access to non-basic lands?
Quote from: Solo on May 08, 2012, 03:51:32 PM
So really quickly... Back to the fetching lands thingy... Are there any current standard cards that allow for easy access to non-basic lands?
{primeval Titan}
Quote from: darkarts981 on May 08, 2012, 03:55:10 PM
Quote from: Solo on May 08, 2012, 03:51:32 PM
So really quickly... Back to the fetching lands thingy... Are there any current standard cards that allow for easy access to non-basic lands?
{primeval Titan}
For a few more months at least muahahhaha
Quote from: Willthomjr on May 08, 2012, 03:58:07 PM
Quote from: darkarts981 on May 08, 2012, 03:55:10 PM
Quote from: Solo on May 08, 2012, 03:51:32 PM
So really quickly... Back to the fetching lands thingy... Are there any current standard cards that allow for easy access to non-basic lands?
{primeval Titan}
For a few more months at least muahahhaha
Unless it gets a reprint
Quote from: darkarts981 on May 08, 2012, 03:59:15 PM
Quote from: Willthomjr on May 08, 2012, 03:58:07 PM
Quote from: darkarts981 on May 08, 2012, 03:55:10 PM
Quote from: Solo on May 08, 2012, 03:51:32 PM
So really quickly... Back to the fetching lands thingy... Are there any current standard cards that allow for easy access to non-basic lands?
{primeval Titan}
For a few more months at least muahahhaha
Unless it gets a reprint
They had their glory for long enough. Cards are ridiculously good for black and green anyways (reds decent too)
Quote from: Willthomjr on May 08, 2012, 04:02:06 PM
Quote from: darkarts981 on May 08, 2012, 03:59:15 PM
Quote from: Willthomjr on May 08, 2012, 03:58:07 PM
Quote from: darkarts981 on May 08, 2012, 03:55:10 PM
Quote from: Solo on May 08, 2012, 03:51:32 PM
So really quickly... Back to the fetching lands thingy... Are there any current standard cards that allow for easy access to non-basic lands?
{primeval Titan}
For a few more months at least muahahhaha
Unless it gets a reprint
They had their glory for long enough. Cards are ridiculously good for black and green anyways (reds decent too)
Yeah, they can't continue, but if they do...