If anyone casts a fat {black sun zenith}
and i have my creatures with undying out but they've already come back with counters. Now when they die, (From the zenith), they come back again right?
Let's say you have a Young Wolf with a +1 counter, your opponent casts BSZ with X = 2 (or more). Assuming you have no other sources that is/will pump your wolf's toughness, it dies and enter the graveyard. The -1 counters is enough to kill your creature as a state based check before the +1 and -1 counters cancel out, therefore your wolf dies with a +1 counter.
On the other hand, if BSZ has X = 1 in this case with Young Wolf with a +1 counter, the + and - 1 counters will cancel out and your wolf will return to stock stats.
Quote from: D3g3n on April 27, 2012, 03:42:27 AM
Let's say you have a Young Wolf with a +1 counter, your opponent casts BSZ with X = 2 (or more). Assuming you have no other sources that is/will pump your wolf's toughness, it dies and enter the graveyard. The -1 counters is enough to kill your creature as a state based check before the +1 and -1 counters cancel out, therefore your wolf dies with a +1 counter.
On the other hand, if BSZ has X = 1 in this case with Young Wolf with a +1 counter, the + and - 1 counters will cancel out and your wolf will return to stock stats.
I have no idea of what you just said other than the result. When do +1 counters get negated then?
Creatures need be alive aka survive the black sun for SBA to trigger and cancel out the counters.
If an undying creature has a +1/+1 counter on it and dies due to {Black Sun's Zenith}'s -1/-1 counters, it stays dead.
Reason is that the state based effect that checks the amount of equal +1/+1 and -1/-1 counters to remove does not remove these counters before a creature dies from the zero toughness. So the wolf's ability checks for +1/+1 counters when it hits the graveyard and since the counters weren't removed it stays dead.
Consider it like this. Say that.. Wolverine, with his super awesome healing powers, has undying. He gets shot, whatever, he heals back up. But say he gets hurled into the sun and is straight up obliterated. He just didn't get the chance for the healing to happen, it was too fast.
Wolverine needs to survive the attack to heal, and an undying creature needs to survive the barrage of -1/-1 counters to be able to come back.
I dont like wolverine... But i understand!!
Thanks you gais! I am dissapointed though :(
Oh well! :D