My opponent has a {thragtusk} and a {silverblade paladin} paired and on field. I the {bonfire of the damned} for 4 damage. He blinks thrag with a {restoration angel} and blinks the silverblade with a {cloudshift}. So in my mind the blinks are irrelevant because the target of the bonfire still exists. So 4 damage would be delt to the silverblade, thragtusk, rest angel, and the token because the target of the bonfire is the player. So when the damage is dealt. His creatures are then targeted.
I didn't feel like fighting with the store owner on this to get this straitened out so I let it go. He beat me cause all his creatures stayed on field. So can anyone help me out with a ruling?
Yep, they should have lost all their creatures and gained 1 life & be left with a new 3/3 token.
The only real way to explain it properly is to explain how the stack works and identify when each spell resolves.
To avoid repeating everything already said, you might refer to the stickied thread on this topic.
RESOLVED
So basically the question is when does bonfire check for the targeted players' creatures, during casting or resolution? I'm having a major brain fart and don't remember which it is...
Nevermind I just answered my own question... The creatures may have been flickered but since they aren't being targeted it doesn't matter. Since the player is the target, during resolution bonfire checks for creatures. Doesn't matter if they've been flickered 100 times.
Quote from: Wally on January 15, 2013, 12:30:38 AM
Yep, they should have lost all their creatures and gained 1 life & be left with a new 3/3 token.
The only real way to explain it properly is to explain how the stack works and identify when each spell resolves.
To avoid repeating everything already said, you might refer to the stickied thread on this topic.
RESOLVED
Just to clarify for anyone who didn't get why it is 1 life gained, the man is talking about net gain.
5 gained from {Thragtusk} minus 4 lost from {Bonfire of the Damned} equals to 1 net life gain.
Quote from: An Angry Fatman on January 15, 2013, 12:19:58 AM
My opponent has a {thragtusk} and a {silverblade paladin} paired and on field. I the {bonfire of the damned} for 4 damage. He blinks thrag with a {restoration angel} and blinks the silverblade with a {cloudshift}. So in my mind the blinks are irrelevant because the target of the bonfire still exists. So 4 damage would be delt to the silverblade, thragtusk, rest angel, and the token because the target of the bonfire is the player. So when the damage is dealt. His creatures are then targeted.
I didn't feel like fighting with the store owner on this to get this straitened out so I let it go. He beat me cause all his creatures stayed on field. So can anyone help me out with a ruling?
I understand not wanting to strain your energy on fighting with someone, but why didn't you just call judge and have him answer? No stress and just do whatever he says. Either he knows he rules and makes the right call or he doesn't and you lose anyways.
I've always wondered about {cloudshift} and board wipes. Since {cloudshift} is newest on the stack, it resolves first, putting the creature back into play, then the wipe ({supreme verdict} for example) resolves, killing even the {cloudshift}ed creature. Am i right in my understanding of it?
Quote from: Cfrowein on January 15, 2013, 08:01:52 AM
Quote from: An Angry Fatman on January 15, 2013, 12:19:58 AM
My opponent has a {thragtusk} and a {silverblade paladin} paired and on field. I the {bonfire of the damned} for 4 damage. He blinks thrag with a {restoration angel} and blinks the silverblade with a {cloudshift}. So in my mind the blinks are irrelevant because the target of the bonfire still exists. So 4 damage would be delt to the silverblade, thragtusk, rest angel, and the token because the target of the bonfire is the player. So when the damage is dealt. His creatures are then targeted.
I didn't feel like fighting with the store owner on this to get this straitened out so I let it go. He beat me cause all his creatures stayed on field. So can anyone help me out with a ruling?
I understand not wanting to strain your energy on fighting with someone, but why didn't you just call judge and have him answer? No stress and just do whatever he says. Either he knows he rules and makes the right call or he doesn't and you lose anyways.
It might not have been a tournament game with a judge present.
But couldn't you just resto angel and cloudshift after bonfire resolves after damage is dealt. To play them in response would be dumb cause youd still loss all your creatures but playing them after resolution would work, would it not? It's simply a matter of timing.
Quote from: Mikefrompluto on January 15, 2013, 09:28:10 AM
I've always wondered about {cloudshift} and board wipes. Since {cloudshift} is newest on the stack, it resolves first, putting the creature back into play, then the wipe ({supreme verdict} for example) resolves, killing even the {cloudshift}ed creature. Am i right in my understanding of it?
Yes, board wipes are content to wait until the spells above them resolve before going off. This is because they don't target, and in between spells resolving, the game can't say, "wait a minute, this no longer has a legal target" and "counter" it.
And that's why I don't play on Cockatrice anymore. EVERYONE tries to pull that to save their own creatures.
Quote from: Double-O-Scotch on January 15, 2013, 10:00:25 AM
But couldn't you just resto angel and cloudshift after bonfire resolves after damage is dealt. To play them in response would be dumb cause youd still loss all your creatures but playing them after resolution would work, would it not? It's simply a matter of timing.
If its lethal damage, this will not work. Once lethal damage is dealt to a creature, it dies, and you cannot respond to a creature dying in this way. The game just won't allow it.
Quote from: Fenster on January 15, 2013, 09:30:45 AM
Quote from: Cfrowein on January 15, 2013, 08:01:52 AM
Quote from: An Angry Fatman on January 15, 2013, 12:19:58 AM
My opponent has a {thragtusk} and a {silverblade paladin} paired and on field. I the {bonfire of the damned} for 4 damage. He blinks thrag with a {restoration angel} and blinks the silverblade with a {cloudshift}. So in my mind the blinks are irrelevant because the target of the bonfire still exists. So 4 damage would be delt to the silverblade, thragtusk, rest angel, and the token because the target of the bonfire is the player. So when the damage is dealt. His creatures are then targeted.
I didn't feel like fighting with the store owner on this to get this straitened out so I let it go. He beat me cause all his creatures stayed on field. So can anyone help me out with a ruling?
I understand not wanting to strain your energy on fighting with someone, but why didn't you just call judge and have him answer? No stress and just do whatever he says. Either he knows he rules and makes the right call or he doesn't and you lose anyways.
It might not have been a tournament game with a judge present.
Ah very true
Man, I need to stop playing at that bloody store. The owner kept telling us that you can do that with both resto and cloudshift. "its in the rules!", he claimed. Those guys don't know their ass from a hole in the ground. I don't know what game they're playing with those cards, but it certainly isn't magic. Thanks guys, this forum keeps me on the straight and narrow so I can establish when to call BS.
Aaaaaaand, BS!