{karn liberated} can I target a player with no cards and hand with his plus 4 ability.
Yes, it will return will "fail to search/ find" and result in no card actually being exiled.
Is there a ruling for this? I could not find one.
Don't need one adding the lotalty counters is the cost so what happens with the effect is not important.
Correct. As long as the player is a legal target when you activate, Karn will get counters.
You targe the player, not their cards in hand.
Quote from: Cal8301 on September 25, 2012, 04:58:32 PM
Don't need one adding the lotalty counters is the cost so what happens with the effect is not important.
Right idea, but not totally true. You do need a legal target to activate the ability.
Not sure about that causes had {jace, memory adept} my opponent hex proff via {witchbane orb}. So I asked the judge if I could target him and nothing happen would jace still plus one. He sayed since my opponent was not a legal target I couldn't. He did say I could draw one than mill myself one. I know we have talked about this before.
A player having hex proof from {Witchbane Orb} does not equal a player having no cards in hand. The ability cares about targeting the player, not target hand with cards in it. You can still tap a creature that's tapped with spells like {Frost Breath}, you know?
It doesnt gain immunity from tap effects, and having no cards in hand doesn't make you immune to discard effects.
Quote from: Maximo on September 25, 2012, 11:18:16 PM
A player having hex proof from {Witchbane Orb} does not equal a player having no cards in hand. The ability cares about targeting the player, not target hand with cards in it. You can still tap a creature that's tapped with spells like {Frost Breath}, you know?
It doesnt gain immunity from tap effects, and having no cards in hand doesn't make you immune to discard effects.
Well put
Now it seems like we are talking about two separate things. I get the karn question. It doesn't target the card in hand it target the player. However if a player has hex proof he can't be a legal target. That is what we are all saying I think just in different ways.
To plainly answer your original post, yes, you can target a player with no hand with Karn's +4 ability.
To answer what seems to be your new question, no, you can't target a player who has hexproof with any abilities that say "Target player", including Planeswalker abilities. You can still target yourself to up your loyalty though, unless you have shroud somehow.
That is what I was trying to say we just keep saying the same things over again.
... Then the question is resolved, gavel, the end.