Some issues

Quote from: MisterJH on May 12, 2013, 04:51:19 PM

As ive said before, both sides are wrong. There is no win in this argument, the church is greedy and the government is pushy and demanding. Im disappointed im both sides.

Not trying to beat a dead horse with you. But if its pushy for the government to force the church to give its employees contraceptions. Why is in not push of the church not to give them?

What? Im not quite understanding the last sentence

Sorry if I'm not explaining it well. I was just meaning that isn't it pushy of the church to not want to give there employees the option to use contraceptions.

Uhhhh..? No. No sir. Not even close. Do you understand what being pushy is? The catholic church is not PUSHing their beliefs on anyone. Their defending their policies/morals. The employees can get their contraception elsewhere, just not from an institution that disagrees with the idea. The government is trying to PUSH the church into supplying what they do not support. Gosh that made my head hurt

So saying we don't believe in in or it doesn't meet our moral values so we will no supply it isn't pushing their values on there employees

So saying we don't believe in in or it doesn't meet our moral values so we will no supply it isn't pushing their values on there employees

No, refusing to supply is not the same as forcing values. Otherwise me having opinions of any kind would be considered 'forcing my values.' Just because they as an organization have an opinion does not mean all their employees must share it- theyre simply having said employees use a different means of receiving contraception, rather than supplying it themselves against their own moral codes. Just because i dont like golf doesnt mean im FORCING MY VALUES ON YOU, for example. Enormous difference, idk why youre failing to understand.

Quote from: Rass on May 12, 2013, 05:54:00 PM

So saying we don't believe in in or it doesn't meet our moral values so we will no supply it isn't pushing their values on there employees

No, refusing to supply is not the same as forcing values. Otherwise me having opinions of any kind would be considered 'forcing my values.' Just because they as an organization have an opinion does not mean all their employees must share it- theyre simply having said employees use a different means of receiving contraception, rather than supplying it themselves against their own moral codes. Just because i dont like golf doesnt mean im FORCING MY VALUES ON YOU, for example. Enormous difference, idk why youre failing to understand.

Just because the comic book store I like does not sell Shadow Era cards does not mean the comic book store is pushing their values onto me. It just means I have to purchase my Shadow Era cards somewhere else.  This is the same thing.  Just because a Catholic hospital does not provide contraception does not mean they are pushing their values onto their patients.  It just means the patients have to get contraceptives somewhere else.

Quote from: MisterJH on May 12, 2013, 06:09:47 PM

Quote from: Rass on May 12, 2013, 05:54:00 PM

So saying we don't believe in in or it doesn't meet our moral values so we will no supply it isn't pushing their values on there employees

No, refusing to supply is not the same as forcing values. Otherwise me having opinions of any kind would be considered 'forcing my values.' Just because they as an organization have an opinion does not mean all their employees must share it- theyre simply having said employees use a different means of receiving contraception, rather than supplying it themselves against their own moral codes. Just because i dont like golf doesnt mean im FORCING MY VALUES ON YOU, for example. Enormous difference, idk why youre failing to understand.

Just because the comic book store I like does not sell Shadow Era cards does not mean the comic book store is pushing their values onto me. It just means I have to purchase my Shadow Era cards somewhere else.  This is the same thing.  Just because a Catholic hospital does not provide contraception does not mean they are pushing their values onto their patients.  It just means the patients have to get contraceptives somewhere else.

Thank you

Another example. Assume you LOVE baseball, its the best sport in the world- to you. 'If i say no, i like lacrosse more' am i forcing my belief on you? No, im saying i have a different belef. That is all.

Yes, In practice Catholic Church cannot force me not to buy contraceptives because they do not have monopoly on selling contraceptives.

I guess we are arguing two different sides. I read where the Catholic Church did not want to supply birth control pills to there employees thru there insurance. All other company's I know of offer this to there employees if they offer insurance. That is where aim saying they are trying to push there values.

Wow, so it's Obamacare stuff?

I guess we are arguing two different sides. I read where the Catholic Church did not want to supply birth control pills to there employees thru there insurance. All other company's I know of offer this to there employees if they offer insurance. That is where aim saying they are trying to push there values.

Freedom of religion is offered and practices in the US.  The catholic church can choose to provide insurance, BUT they do not provide contraceptives due to the fact that it is against their religion.  Now, when the government FORCES the catholic church to provide contraceptives, this now goes against their freedom of religion. 

And the problem with this is, why were they forced to give it out in the first place.  I mean who had the bright idea to do this to the catholic church.  What corrupted, idiot decided one day, "**** freedom of religion, let's make them do something that they believe will bring hell upon them" because keep in mind, they believe that is true.

Now I am a christain, baptist.  And we don't agree with some of the things the catholic church says, but I will standby my fellow religion when their rights are infringed upon. 

The religion believes you should be allowed to. However it does not believe that being without a knife will condemn you to hell, does it? If it does, correct me, but if not youre comparing apples to oranges

Recent events have led to downvotes among us.  Remember, don't like someone's beliefs, then don't downvote them for it. 

Why not?

Because piotr, it would be morally wrong.  I'm friends with democrats, and I don't agree at all with their actions.  But I don't shun those democratic friends because of it.